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[#] Thu Oct 10 2013 14:40:21 EDT from IGnatius T Foobar @ Uncensored

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momentum of his predictions far outweigh Gartner or other "think
tanks".

Gartner Goop? They can't predict shit. All they do is get paid to say "current trends will continue" by pointy-headeds who want to cover their asses and point to a Gartner Goop document if a decision they made causes problems.

[#] Thu Oct 10 2013 18:55:18 EDT from fleeb @ Uncensored

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Actually, if you read the comments in the article, he reveals that he miswrote when he described c/c++ in that way, and that he should have stated that they have fallen into niche markets.

I can agree with that. But it certainly hasn't been obsolete for 'decades'.
That's utterly ridiculous.

[#] Fri Oct 11 2013 02:03:27 EDT from dothebart @ Uncensored

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well, they had more dominant times; however usual linux applications still tend to be written in C; I also don't know a commandline shell written in an interpreted language as you can get for windows.



[#] Fri Oct 11 2013 17:11:57 EDT from fleeb @ Uncensored

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Windows now has PowerShell.

I haven't done much with it, but it seems like a considerably more powerful shell for the OS. But, this is the wrong room for anything pro-Microsoft (and I'm not one who likes to give them props anyway).

[#] Sat Oct 12 2013 01:04:58 EDT from ax25 @ Uncensored

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Fri Oct 11 2013 05:11:57 PM EDT from fleeb @ Uncensored

Windows now has PowerShell.

I haven't done much with it, but it seems like a considerably more powerful shell for the OS. But, this is the wrong room for anything pro-Microsoft (and I'm not one who likes to give them props anyway).

As one who has looked at PowerShell and the wraper-ing of win32/64 crap named libraries with camel case and periods for Windows libraries... I can safely say, avoid (until someone else writes a better wrapper around that steaming pile).



[#] Sat Oct 12 2013 03:31:02 EDT from dothebart @ Uncensored

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Fri Oct 11 2013 17:11:57 EDT from fleeb @ Uncensored

Windows now has PowerShell.

I haven't done much with it, but it seems like a considerably more powerful shell for the OS. But, this is the wrong room for anything pro-Microsoft (and I'm not one who likes to give them props anyway).

yes, written in see-carpet -> shell written in an interpreted language.



[#] Tue Oct 15 2013 10:52:56 EDT from IGnatius T Foobar @ Uncensored

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Yes, because when they decided to build a real shell to replace cmd.exe, they couldn't just go with the established standard POSIX shell. Because they're determined to follow in IBM's footsteps, they had to instead build REXX, er, I mean PowerShell with all of its weird syntax, un-memorizable parameters, and the kind of object integration only lovable by the person who wrote it.

This will eventually come back to bite them. Just ask IBM, who has spent the last two decades trying to (badly) POSIX-ize their proprietary stuff.

[#] Tue Oct 15 2013 21:21:06 EDT from ax25 @ Uncensored

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Many people had written a better shell than cmd in their spare time.  I would imagine they have done the same for PooperShell as well, but I just stick to compiled Python if I need a new tool on Winders.



[#] Wed Oct 16 2013 04:14:26 EDT from dothebart @ Uncensored

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but... why not use see-carpet? the interpreter comes with the OS ;-P



[#] Wed Oct 16 2013 10:10:06 EDT from ax25 @ Uncensored

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Wed Oct 16 2013 04:14:26 AM EDT from dothebart @ Uncensored

but... why not use see-carpet? the interpreter comes with the OS ;-P



Because I lost my taste for Java like programming back in the late 90's and early 2000's.



[#] Thu Oct 17 2013 06:34:39 EDT from dothebart @ Uncensored

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Wed Oct 16 2013 10:10:06 EDT from ax25 @ Uncensored
Wed Oct 16 2013 04:14:26 AM EDT from dothebart @ Uncensored

but... why not use see-carpet? the interpreter comes with the OS ;-P

Because I lost my taste for Java like programming back in the late 90's and early 2000's.

but... butt buttttt you can't compare these! see-carpet pet store example has 30% less LOC than the java one for the same functionality!



[#] Thu Oct 17 2013 14:43:36 EDT from LoanShark @ Uncensored

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I never read through the pet store example, and am proud of it.

[#] Thu Oct 17 2013 15:19:03 EDT from dothebart @ Uncensored

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well, it was one of their marketing $foo.



[#] Fri Oct 18 2013 01:34:58 EDT from ax25 @ Uncensored

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Thu Oct 17 2013 02:43:36 PM EDT from LoanShark @ Uncensored

I never read through the pet store example, and am proud of it.

I think I will bone up on jscript now and then barf.  I did not make it through the canned example, but feel I am a failure for having looked.



[#] Fri Oct 18 2013 05:32:10 EDT from dothebart @ Uncensored

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hell yea, lets port the petshop example to node.js.



[#] Fri Oct 18 2013 08:36:25 EDT from fleeb @ Uncensored

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I've been doing more web-related programming lately.

Unfortunately, yet again, in a Windows environment, so I'm having to deal with IIS, which means dealing with either Visual Basic or C# (or, as in this case, both... one guy wrote stuff in C#, while someone else wrote in VB).

My style of doing web development lends itself to only creating dynamic pages for dynamic data, which means just generating XML from queries to a database and letting a real web page with JavaScript handle with with a jQuery ajax call.

I recreated my former co-worker's web page within a day, but with additional features. He had originally taken a couple of weeks, trying to do it all in C#.

Either I'm a better programmer (which might be true... he's fairly junior), or C# really, really sucks (which might also be true, since Microsoft created it).

[#] Fri Oct 18 2013 09:49:16 EDT from LoanShark @ Uncensored

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C# is OK... maybe he was spending too much time on "design" and "framework" and not enough on actual code ;)

knowing when you need the layers can be tricky...

[#] Fri Oct 18 2013 10:03:48 EDT from dothebart @ Uncensored

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well, webforms was invented with the intention to have an easy way to let people that do forms-applications write web applications.

I think it was in the pre-ajax time?

Sure with JQuery everything is different.

Plus, knowing which fucking attribute to turn to get some string into the output html which you exactly know 'caus you're an html/css/... expert.... is...

tricky.

 



[#] Fri Oct 18 2013 10:21:01 EDT from LoanShark @ Uncensored

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right. web programming is its own sub-specialty, these days, and an increasingly complex one. "knowing C#" or "knowing groovy" or "knowing Python" is not enough anymore.

[#] Sat Oct 19 2013 09:47:10 EDT from IGnatius T Foobar @ Uncensored

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Hey hey, none of this software development CitaDrift now, we were talking about how badly PowerShell sucks as both a command interpreter and as a scripting language.

The point here is that with so many existing solutions available (some of them their own!!) there was no need to create yet another new monstrosity.
But that's exactly what they did.

And it's so bloated that it can take ten seconds or more to even load when you click on the button. It's probably initializing zillions of additional bloated subsystems and object frameworks every time you fire it up.

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