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[#] Sat Oct 25 2008 02:29:24 EDT from flynnfx @ Uncensored

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Is it NOT possible to develop an easy-to-operate, easy-to-understand, inexpensive and relatively stable OS??

Windows : No on all 4 of the above, except been around so long it is the dominant.

Apple : Yes, Yes, No, and Yes - but only works on 20% ofthe systems worldwide - if Apple could develope an OS for the Windows PC they'd annihilate Microsoft.

Linux, Ubuntu, etc - No, No, Yes, Yes. Make these easier to undestand for the common folk, and you'd see Windows share drop dramtically.

 

What we need out there to kill Microsoft is this:

 

An OS that will run Windows programs, but is not Windows. Easy to set-up, easy to learn, maybe $50-$100 and very few crashes.

When this is developed, say hello to the death of Microsoft.



[#] Sat Oct 25 2008 05:41:59 EDT from fleeb @ Uncensored

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Every Operating System Sucks.

That's kind of an axiom.



[#] Sat Oct 25 2008 08:00:44 EDT from BOFHMike @ My Castle Wall

Subject: *nix, My $0.02 worth

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Sat Oct 25 2008 06:29:24 UTC from flynnfx@uncnsrd (Uncensored)

Is it NOT possible to develop an easy-to-operate, easy-to-understand, inexpensive and relatively stable OS??

 

My *NIX Answer to the question: 

Would I consider myself uber *.nix geek? absolutely not.  Do I know more about *.nix then average kid coming out of collage today and hitting the IT market, probably not.  I do a fair bit of reading and I run my own set of servers to keep my hands in it as much as possible, but my system has been very* stable for years assides from some ageing hardware.

Easy to Operate, Absolutely!  with tools like YAST, all of the OS/Hardware/System configuration tools are in one place.  I still configure some things by hand out of habit, but there is very* little reason for me to do it that way. I'll even toss in easy to install, SuSE 10 Enterprise Server Edition, 4 CD's, took less then four hours with me playing around with the install package list to add and drop packages that I wanted to play with.  Using click through install, it could have happened a LOT faster.  If you mean easy to operate for a general user, not a problem, thell them it's Mojave, and set the gui to kde. ;) 

Inexpensive, That's up for debate.  I pay about $300/yr for a "subscription" that gives me all* updates (OS version & patches.) so that I can* install SuSE 11 when it comes out as well as e-mail tech support.  Considering the per-incident cost to get assistance from MS, I could drop the "subscription", and pay per incident and still be cheaper then MS.

Stable... Hot damn, I leave my servers to run themself for the most part.  In the past five years and possibly more, I can't think of a single OS related problem I've had.  I've had problems with verions of software not being happy when trying to move citadel from one box to another, but that wan't the OS's fault.  I've had more problems due to old hardware then anything else.  At my day job we have a windows servers that need to be rebooted nearly every week.  My linux boxes have had year plus uptimes. (I would need a generator in order to keep them up any longer)

Run windows apps, why would you?  General users run Office, and not much else.  We have Open Office, and Star Office (if you want the commercial support). There are tools like wine that have been around for years.



[#] Sat Oct 25 2008 09:36:19 EDT from IGnatius T Foobar @ Uncensored

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flynn: you're asking the wrong question. The market share of Windows has nothing to do with the quality of the product. The only thing Windows has going for it right now is its incumbency. Studies have shown that people who don't have any computer experience and who don't know anything about the network effect of Windows, tend to select Linux or Apple when given the opportunity to evaluate all three.

[#] Sat Oct 25 2008 10:18:09 EDT from Ragnar Danneskjold @ Uncensored

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Oct 25 2008 9:36am from IGnatius T Foobar @uncnsrd
flynn: you're asking the wrong question. The market share of Windows

has nothing to do with the quality of the product. The only thing
Windows has going for it right now is its incumbency. Studies have
shown that people who don't have any computer experience and who don't

know anything about the network effect of Windows, tend to select Linux

or Apple when given the opportunity to evaluate all three.



Actually I doubt that's true....

I just saw a thing about the Asus Eee PC. Comes in two flavors - Linux and Windows. The vast majority of the returns are the Linux version... And not only that, people are returning them for the Windows version because they find the Linux version is difficult to use.

And, I'm also sure it's getting harder and harder to find people with no computer experience at all.

[#] Sat Oct 25 2008 10:52:45 EDT from the8088er @ Uncensored

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my apple answer to the question:
Apple once licensed the Mac OS to a company called Power Computing to make less expensive Macintosh OS computers. It was a terrible experince for all involved and thankfully Apple pulled the licenses before more unfortunate souls put their cash in a Power Computing box. They sucked. Big time.
Apple is primarily a hardware company and selling the software independantly would not net them enough cash. Also if they sold it to run on anything it would really hurt the stability. Part of the reason Mac is so stable is there is only one sound card in most Macs, etc. Driver problems are non-existant for the most part on a stock Macintosh.

[#] Sat Oct 25 2008 11:51:20 EDT from IGnatius T Foobar @ Uncensored

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I just saw a thing about the Asus Eee PC. Comes in two flavors -
Linux and Windows. The vast majority of the returns are the Linux
version... And not only that, people are returning them for the
Windows version because they find the Linux version is difficult to
use.

That turned out to be a lie propagated by the Microsoft-sponsored trade rags.

Asus said it isn't true.

[#] Sat Oct 25 2008 12:26:53 EDT from LoanShark @ Uncensored

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Apple's software support lifecycle really ruins my day[3~, though. If not for that, I'd consider buying one. (WHAT lifecycle?)

IG putting forth the idea that people with no computer experience tend to select Linux, though, is patently ridiculous.

[#] Sat Oct 25 2008 12:54:09 EDT from IGnatius T Foobar @ Uncensored

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Ridiculous if you're Steve Ballmer, yes.

[#] Sat Oct 25 2008 14:07:45 EDT from the8088er @ Uncensored

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Apple's software support lifecycle really ruins my day[3~, though. If

not for that, I'd consider buying one. (WHAT lifecycle?)

huh? i have a 10 year old powerbook g3 that runs os 10.4 and browses the web fine. what ten year old pc does xp support again?

[#] Sat Oct 25 2008 14:38:24 EDT from triLcat @ Uncensored

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I had a company switch all the computers to Linux (SUSE). Those of us who are intelligent liked it better within a day or two. The idiots took about 3 days to come to terms with it.

there was one flub with a few office files that disappeared, but once we got those taken care of, all was well.



[#] Sat Oct 25 2008 15:34:53 EDT from IGnatius T Foobar @ Uncensored

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That's about the sum of it. The idea that Linux's lack of significant desktop share has anything to do with usability is a myth. Linux isn't difficult to use. And even if that was a problem, it isn't relevant because people spent years tweaking autoexec.bat, config.sys, and *.ini when they could have just bought a Mac.

Windows is widespread because of its incumbency. Period. No one in their right mind would willingly choose it over Linux or Mac for any other reason.

[#] Sat Oct 25 2008 15:54:37 EDT from triLcat @ Uncensored

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apparently,my husband's company is scurrying to buy boxes (mainly laptops) with XP b/c the IT department is horrified by Vista. (My husband's lab already has a Vista machine - he's enjoying it very much for gaming)

[#] Sun Oct 26 2008 13:18:31 EDT from triLcat @ Uncensored

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I may actually get my linux box (before Harry)

My dad will hopefully soon be dumping his thinkpad that came with Windows ME.

It's either linux or doorstop.



[#] Sun Oct 26 2008 13:21:54 EDT from LoanShark @ Uncensored

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does it have at least 512mb ram?

[#] Sun Oct 26 2008 13:25:53 EDT from triLcat @ Uncensored

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might be 256

[#] Sun Oct 26 2008 13:57:30 EDT from LoanShark @ Uncensored

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not sure i'd recommend < 512, even with linux.

[#] Sun Oct 26 2008 14:38:11 EDT from triLcat @ Uncensored

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I probably won't get the thing 'til sometime next week. When I know its specs, I'll post.

I'm thinking of just office & straight webbrowsing



[#] Sun Oct 26 2008 17:51:51 EDT from dothebart @ Uncensored

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Sa Okt 25 2008 10:18:09 EDT von Ragnar Danneskjold@uncnsrd

Oct 25 2008 9:36am from IGnatius T Foobar @uncnsrd
flynn: you're asking the wrong question. The market share of Windows
has nothing to do with the quality of the product. The only thing
Windows has going for it right now is its incumbency. Studies have
shown that people who don't have any computer experience and who don't

know anything about the network effect of Windows, tend to select Linux

or Apple when given the opportunity to evaluate all three.



Actually I doubt that's true....

I just saw a thing about the Asus Eee PC. Comes in two flavors - Linux and Windows. The vast majority of the returns are the Linux version... And not only that, people are returning them for the Windows version because they find the Linux version is difficult to use.

And, I'm also sure it's getting harder and harder to find people with no computer experience at all.

Ragnar, what you're telling here is just plain wrong.

I know that statement, its not from Asus, Its another of those netbook manufacturers.

In contrast, Asus has a complmntary statement; its lower.



[#] Sun Oct 26 2008 17:57:23 EDT from dothebart @ Uncensored

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So Okt 26 2008 14:38:11 EDT von triLcat@uncnsrd

I probably won't get the thing 'til sometime next week. When I know its specs, I'll post.

I'm thinking of just office & straight webbrowsing

Browsing in general is a big mem-eater.

maybe using opera enlightens it a bit; mozilla told they' d slim ff 3.x, but we'll see....



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