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[#] Sat Jan 04 2014 19:10:21 EST from the_mgt @ Uncensored

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Well, make citadel-setup remote-capable, kind of a puppetmaster. ;)



[#] Sun Jan 05 2014 01:57:13 EST from ax25 @ Uncensored

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Sat Jan 04 2014 07:10:21 PM EST from the_mgt @ Uncensored

Well, make citadel-setup remote-capable, kind of a puppetmaster. ;)



Interesting thought, but I would think finding the "works for all software" solution to the existing solutions better than taking on yet another role for Citadel that is far outside the norm.  I could very well be wrong though, as the coders for Citadel are quite clever :-)

I would be quite interested in anybody that finds something that fits the bill better than a full VM and setup via scripted ssh session.

 



[#] Sun Jan 05 2014 05:33:01 EST from dothebart @ Uncensored

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Sun Jan 05 2014 01:57:13 EST from ax25 @ Uncensored
Sat Jan 04 2014 07:10:21 PM EST from the_mgt @ Uncensored

Well, make citadel-setup remote-capable, kind of a puppetmaster. ;)

Interesting thought, but I would think finding the "works for all software" solution to the existing solutions better than taking on yet another role for Citadel that is far outside the norm.  I could very well be wrong though, as the coders for Citadel are quite clever :-)

I would be quite interested in anybody that finds something that fits the bill better than a full VM and setup via scripted ssh session.

well... with not having a plaintext config citadel is sort of an exception here already.

however, the biggest advantage of using debian above other distributions is the lots of work which was put into the debconf system - and not being able to utilize this makes that effort nonsense and better use fedora or whatever.

Here we then again have the troubles of not being able to run setup - one could think of having a sourceable shellscript into the initscript which then calls setup & starts citserver.



[#] Sun Jan 05 2014 06:09:08 EST from the_mgt @ Uncensored

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The config is a hex-file instead of plain text, isn't it? What is the trouble, writing a hexfile into the container?

I admit to have no clue about the whole process, though. Just wondering.



[#] Sun Jan 05 2014 23:13:07 EST from ax25 @ Uncensored

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Sun Jan 05 2014 05:33:01 AM ESTfrom dothebart @ Uncensored
well... with not having a plaintext config citadel is sort of an exception here already.

however, the biggest advantage of using debian above other distributions is the lots of work which was put into the debconf system - and not being able to utilize this makes that effort nonsense and better use fedora or whatever.

Here we then again have the troubles of not being able to run setup - one could think of having a sourceable shellscript into the initscript which then calls setup & starts citserver.

But there are many packages that take tweaking post install on Debian using debconf.  Most MTA setups that I can think of include the need to run another setup script (Exim, Postfix etc...).  As I have never installed Citadel from the debs, I guess I don't know how you guys do that presently and should probably check it out before commenting further.



[#] Mon Jan 06 2014 07:50:40 EST from IGnatius T Foobar @ Uncensored

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well... with not having a plaintext config citadel is sort of an
exception here already.

At some point in the not too distant future the config file is going to become XML. That would allow a lot of third party tools to manipulate it.

[#] Mon Jan 06 2014 13:27:44 EST from dothebart @ Uncensored

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Mon Jan 06 2014 07:50:40 EST from IGnatius T Foobar @ Uncensored
well... with not having a plaintext config citadel is sort of an
exception here already.

At some point in the not too distant future the config file is going to become XML. That would allow a lot of third party tools to manipulate it.

objegction your highness, yaml is the way to go. Human readable & editable in the end plus ready made parsers & dumpers widely available, highlight modes for all common editors.

printf'ing xml out sucks and destroys users edits.



[#] Tue Jan 07 2014 11:10:18 EST from IGnatius T Foobar @ Uncensored

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We can discuss this in the dev room when it's time to implement, but my objection to YAML is that we would have to add Yet Another parser library into the build.

[#] Fri Jan 10 2014 15:29:07 EST from fleeb @ Uncensored

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A recruiter contacted me today about an opportunity working on Linux... something I have wanted to do for literally years.

Oddly, my relatively scant background in Python might be the thing that gets the job for me. They can't seem to find enough people with much of a background in Python, which seems weird to me.

So, maintaining a build system written in Python 7 years ago finally pays off.

[#] Fri Jan 10 2014 16:04:36 EST from IGnatius T Foobar @ Uncensored

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If you get the job we shall celebrate by getting you a keyboard with double-reinforced Tab and Space keys.

[#] Sat Jan 11 2014 14:02:37 EST from LoanShark @ Uncensored

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Oddly, my relatively scant background in Python might be the thing

that gets the job for me. They can't seem to find enough people with

much of a background in Python, which seems weird to me.

You know, a friend of a friend of mine (IG may know this guy, too - Centurion was his handle for a little while) is looking for a Python guy, in the Westchester or NYC area I guess.


[#] Sat Jan 11 2014 15:40:02 EST from fleeb @ Uncensored

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My current keyboard clacks aloud in a way that ensures anyone within a five mile radius realizes I'm working on an e-mail.

I wonder if Python is making some kind of resurgence. I see that Python has iterated to version 3.x, breaking compatibility with all earlier versions as they never did before, but probably in a good way.

[#] Sat Jan 11 2014 17:58:24 EST from IGnatius T Foobar @ Uncensored

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Python seems to be the standard answer for open source folks who want to work in a managed code environment but aren't willing to deal with the frustration of Java or C#. Its adherents certainly are devout. I can take it or leave it.

[#] Sun Jan 12 2014 10:40:12 EST from fleeb @ Uncensored

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It seems weird to me, regardless. System-like programming with a scripting language feels counter-intuitive. That said, I'm not completely sure what these guys hope to accomplish. Maybe a scripting language is good enough.

[#] Sun Jan 12 2014 13:55:29 EST from dothebart @ Uncensored

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Sat Jan 11 2014 15:40:02 EST from fleeb @ Uncensored
I wonder if Python is making some kind of resurgence. I see that Python has iterated to version 3.x, breaking compatibility with all earlier versions as they never did before, but probably in a good way.

which seems to be some of the drama of python; most of the production systems seem to be on 2.x even 5 years after the first 3.x release...

All of the important libs are available for 3x meanwhile; but availability in LTS distribution is only slowly happening

as for the choice of interpreted languages - as long as most of your system is about I/O from DB etc. anyways, its acceptable.

i.e. python tornado seems to be a pretty good thing to do _fast_ & scaleable systems like people also do with nodejs.

For shure ruby has to be named too for favoourite languages used by those doing creative programming with linux as host os.



[#] Sun Jan 12 2014 19:53:12 EST from fleeb @ Uncensored

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Yeah, I see a lot of stuff up for Ruby. I've looked at it a little, but never seriously got into it.

Then again, I don't tend to seriously do much of anything until money becomes involved, heh.

[#] Mon Jan 13 2014 14:36:12 EST from ax25 @ Uncensored

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Python works fairly well for me.  I how some of the libraries make it quite stupidly simple to implement things (Requests lib comes to mind):

http://docs.python-requests.org/en/latest/



[#] Mon Jan 13 2014 15:56:25 EST from LoanShark @ Uncensored

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I wonder if Python is making some kind of resurgence. I see that
Python has iterated to version 3.x, breaking compatibility with all
earlier versions as they never did before, but probably in a good way.


It's pretty hard to make practical use of 3.x. Linux distributions haven't really migrated. It doesn't ship with OS X. Many 3rd party libraries haven't moved.

[#] Mon Jan 13 2014 16:37:40 EST from ax25 @ Uncensored

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Mon Jan 13 2014 03:56:25 PM EST from LoanShark @ Uncensored
It's pretty hard to make practical use of 3.x. Linux distributions haven't really migrated. It doesn't ship with OS X. Many 3rd party libraries haven't moved.

I keep trying on each new project, but it is usually some small lib that holds me back.  I will probably use ctypes in future to just wrapper share libs in future.



[#] Mon Jan 13 2014 18:57:48 EST from LoanShark @ Uncensored

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I think they goofed. Python 3.x is not quite Python anymore... it's a closely related new language.

Sorry guys, if you want to fix what you view as fundamental design flaws... shoulda gotten it right the first time.

For all of Java's faults, it's generally done a better job of backwards compatibility. Yes there have been incompatibilities, but those have been pushed out towards the edges of the platform... not right there at its core, in places you use all the time.

2.x is not so horribly bad that people feel the need to suffer through the move.

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