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[#] Wed May 23 2007 14:12:32 EDT from Curly Surmudgeon @ Haven BBS

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IGgy has now nuked  two or three rooms to prevent "Uncensored" users from seeing this posting yet has no shame for violating the very name used.  The only reason this arguement continues is his continued hypocrisy.  Stop censoring, it is wrong and demands combat to contradict the lie.



The deafening silence of our last example of religious intolerance is a most excellent example, let's review events.

Iggy was unable to bully me into submission or self-censorship, so the "net.Religion" room was nuked to prevent participation. Unnecessary, if bUncensoredb users didn't want to see the flames they could use the Zap option. Iggy however was unable to tolerate opposing viewpoints and found it necessary to decide for others what they may see or participate in. That's raw censorship.

Two users, Iggy and Ragnar, went into a typical frenzy or the religious because they were unable to tolerate examples of the negative aspects of their superstitions. We've been presented here a vivid example of negative aspects of superstition, the ugly underbelly if you will. Instead of engaging
in discussion the religious behavior reacts by attacking.

Since burning heretics is illegal today both entered into the modern version, attempting to label others with the most vile label possible in an attempt to silence opposing viewpoints. We've seen this behavior for millenia, Galileo suffered worse. I'm proud to be elevated to his status.

On the bright side society is slowly changing, the number of people rejecting superstition grows each day. Each event, such as the virtual heretic burning here, galvanizes fence-sitters into further disgust toward self-appointed moral guardians. Intolerant practitioners of religion are unable to extrapolate the events now killing the bloated corpse of the Catholic Church. Progress is slow but these barbaric cults are being eradicated from society. Agonizingly slow but evolution works in eons, not lifetimes.

In this case progress is slow because memes, by definition, are difficult to counter. Mankind has reached the point in our evolution where memes and kenes are stronger than genes. In order for our offspring to flourish we must prepare them to resist dogma and indoctrination. When was the last time you heard children referred to as a bDemocratic Childb or an bignorant child?b Yet the same well-meaning speakers do not hesitate to define an adolescent as a "Christian Child" or "Moslem Child."

None of those terms describe any child, they are but labels forced upon the child by their parents and/or society. Can a child grok what it means to be Jewish or Baptist? Yet any adult can sprinkle a bit of water on an infant and speak a dozen words and the baby is somehow constrained for life to that superstition without question.  Brainwashing is not just a rare event but the status quo.

Children are the battleground of ideas.  Religious indoctrination is the accepted norm but is mental abuse any better than physical abuse? If we
see an adult beating a child for some trivial transgression it is incumbent upon others to intercede and halt, with force if necessary, that child being beaten. Yes, doing so is dangerous but we're speaking about probable harm to a vulnerable, weaker, being. This is where the rubber hits the road, do intelligent beings permit certain harm to those of the next generation or do we permit abuse under the guise of "religious tolerance?"  Those two words don't belong in the same sentence.

So it is with religion, any number of trivial offenses threaten a child with an eternity in purgatory. A purgatory obsessively detailed by countless good christians to intimidate others. Mainly children. This is a crime which must be dealt with just as physical child abuse is dealt with, by removing
the child from those abusive homes if necessary.   This topic segues into ritual genital mutilation.

We've seen the circumcision discussion go by, even if Iggy censored it on "Uncensored" it is still available on network nodes or by emailing me
for a copy. In that discussion, rather than confront the child abuse, the religionists defended the practice as "chicks like it." I wonder how many "chicks" Iggy has exposed himself to in making such a blanket statement?

Don't confuse the involuntary with voluntary circumcision, hurting yourself isn't wrong, it's just stupid. Circumcising others though is a crime even if the law hasn't caught up with the barbaric practice yet.  Circumcision is the surgical amputation of flesh containing the highest population of nerve endings in the entire body. Usually without anesthesia. Without permission. Without consideration helpless infants, male and female alike, are mutilated for life. As the religionists here have demonstrated, in absolute ignorance, they do not even understand the effect of their own circumcision. The head of the penis isn't skin, its an exceptionally sensitive mucus membrane just as inside your nose, mouth and anus, its the front line barrier against infection. Compare a dessicated adult penis with a healthy penis with foreskin and tell me which is superior. This doesn't even touch the fundamental concept of circumcising others without permission, just try circumcising an adult male against their wishes and see what happens. A child is little different, other than being submissive and incapable of self-protection. That's what parents are for, protection, not ritual genital mutilation. America is the last Western nation to regularly mutilate their young for god.

God cannot be questioned, it says so in the book. Good reason exists for this refusal for in the light of day religion shrivels like something vile beneath a rock. Because there is no defense for ignorance the religious zombie is encouraged to attack those who reject their particular brand of superstition. As shown here both christian and jew respond identically to rejection with intentional lies and criminal slander. It is going to be interesting to see Iggy decide whether to distribute an acceptable retraction or lose the domain and a sizable chunk of cash.

Consider, for example, the Politica Room. Iggy has been able to bully other network nodes into limiting discussion of religion in politics. The United States has been under attack by the religious right for 30 years. Very successfully I might add. Even here, among the supposedly elite, religious interference in government can't be discussed, we're admonished to take it elsewhere. Iggy doesn't like it so the subject is not permitted by forcing self-censorship or attacking the poster, not the words and ideas.

What concerns me more than the wackos who believe this nonsense is the silent bystander. Religion has elevated itself to the ultimate authority so as to escape scrutiny, that get-out-of-jail card has little value today although by convention and brainwashing many people still nod their heads and tolerate such barbaric behavior. How many readers here actually spoke out against the obvious lies? Only two to my recollection and then they shut up afraid of the ire of someone so emotionally unbalanced as those participate in the modern equivalent of burning heretics at the stake.


I've received emails telling me that they do not agree with the horrid words from bUncensoredb but how many spoke up? The deafening silence in public
indicates that most are cowed, even the aides of these rooms and sys ops on the network are publicly silent. As I said above, this event is an excellent example of religious behavior. That's why I coined the term "crazymotherfuckers."

When an organization demonstrates a pattern of abusive behavior society usually whacks it in a variety of ways. When Corporations become too blatant in cost-cutting either quality suffers or a physical hazard results. In either case the negative publicity injures the perpetrator causing financial pain to cease the pattern. When CEO's abuse their power the Board of Directors are supposed remove them. At the moment bad CEO's are actually rewarded for poor performance with Golden Parachutes. So it is with religion. When Christians are caught with drugs, prostitutes, or buggering children the cult becomes even more protective and defensive. Rather than reject the priest caught buggering alter boys the molesters are given vacations and a new venue
to continue their pattern of criminal behavior. When Evangelicals are caught in motel rooms with prostitutes and drugs they are forgiven unlike those who speak against their hypocrisy and lies. The double standard is so deeply ingrained that few people stand back and objectively view just how warped the situation is.

To speak against uncivilized behavior is to make yourself vulnerable to similar attacks, look at the silence and submissiveness of investigative journalism in regards to the Bush administration crimes. So it is with religion, contrary positions were once a death sentence, today the wackos are less overt but no less vengeful.

Once one leaves the realm of reality and believes in faeries, angels, talking vegetation, levitation, transmutation, divine conception there is little common ground for a rational discourse on the subject. The mind that is able to accept such nonsense is incapable of reason.

While it won't happen in my lifetime society is finally beginning to acknowledge the irrational behavior these cults, and their followers, exhibit and reject the most excessive. Look at the circumcision example. Instead of realizing that they are committing a crime against a defenseless infant well-meaning parents whack the end of their children's penis for god. An entire cult has grown around the importance of this event in at least three religions. Barbarians, all.

The topic cannot even be discussed, even here among supposedly literate, educated people. When I brought up the issue the zealots evaded the crime with "Chicks like a circumcised penis" or "a parent has to do what they feel right." Most were against female circumcision (in reality a cliterectomy)
but intellectually incapable of making the mental leap to male circumcision because the superstition is so deeply ingrained in society. Ritual genital mutilation is ok because god commands it.

Circumcision is a crime when the victim has no say in the mutilation.

This cognitive disconnect is an insurmountable meme among those infected. We can only lament their mental limitations and hope to educate the next generation however the cultists foresaw this danger to their superstition and take great pains to brainwash the child early and deeply.

Are the Amish doing the right thing by limiting their children's future?  Are the Seventh Day Adventists doing the right thing by denying their  children modern medicine? Are the Jehovas doing the right thing for their children by refusing life-saving transfusions? Are the Jewish doing the right thing by mutilating their children's genitals? Are the Moslems ding the right thing for their children by performing a cliterectomy on their female children? Each remains pretty much silent on these issues fearing that their cult will be likewise scrutinized.  And convicted. Just as well-meaning people here remain silent while the cultists slander the opposition.

Iggy has made it abundantly clear that he will not tolerate negativity toward religion. To that end he will lie, slander, pervert the very words we use, violate the moniker "Uncensored" in order to halt discourse. Even a dog doesn't foul it's own nest. Well, the three rooms this thread has weaved through have been shat in. Iggy is free to wallow in the filth , he's found my threshold for disgusting behavior and I won't participate. He's shown that his mind is vastly filthier than mine, that he is intolerant toward opposing ideas, that "Uncensored" is a lie, and an excellent
example of religion in action. I will not play that game.

Ragnar is, well, Ragnar. A chickenhawk, no a really, really, dumb chickenhawk, too indoctrinated for independent thought. Stupidity is its own penalty. Denial of reality is stupid.

America has been turned into a nation of cowards. Politicians and predominant religions use fear to control, manipulate and intimidate.  Where is the collective American spine? Integrity and honesty have been replaced by ignorance, fear and submission. This is a New America, one which lashes out violently over disagreements and xenophobia. The world sees America clearly, its a pity Americans cannot see reality.

What surprises me is those on "Uncensored" who lend their integrity to Art by association. Their worth as thinking human beings is lessened by their silence toward his actions. Not just with me but a long history of attacking opposing viewpoints and rewriting history. From trolling the gay boards 20 years ago he has matured into a more devious version.  Witness the rewriting of citadel history on wikipedia.

The only two who spoke out in my case were both female, make your own deductions of that bit of trivia. The list of people here who cower too frightened to speak out at injustice is disappointing. American society has been muzzled by the theocracy but I had no idea self-proclaimed intellectuals were cowed by the same fear. I do not wish to associate with cowards. This is a sad moment of realization for I respected some of the participants.

Shame on all of you who remain silent in the face of wrongdoing.

Since Iggy has censored not just entire rooms, users, and networked rooms by intimidation but even email to/from bUncensoredb users we must use other lines of communication. Feel free to contact me at

Readers of the Cit/UX network who remain silent must live with the lies and filth of Art. I'm moving on and live in a land where courage hasn't been lost entirely.

When the Nazis came for the communists,
I remained silent;
I was not a communist.

When they locked up the social democrats,
I remained silent;
I was not a social democrat.

When they came for the trade unionists,
I did not speak out;
I was not a trade unionist.

When they came for me,
there was no one left to speak out.

I wish you all a "Eureka" moment. Before it's too late.

[#] Fri Jun 22 2007 13:34:50 EDT from dothebart @ Uncensored

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I've added citadel over at Please create yourself an account, and press on 'Stack' to add yourself to the users list.

[#] Sun Sep 02 2007 09:55:01 EDT from MikeP @ Victory Days

Subject: We're back

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I had one of the board memebers of Victory Days request a BBS and a mail server.  I'm really counting on Citadel to be able to fit the need.   Victory Days Corp. is an educationsl / Living history organization dedicated to provide a positive learning environment for people young and old regaurding life durring the 1940's (WWII era).  " Those who do not read and understand history are doomed to repeat it. - Harry Truman"

    With that, I am looking for networked rooms of Historic and Educational  topics.  Due to the audiance, rooms like Gateway/Hateway will not* be makeing an apearance on this board.  I currently share rooms w/ Dogpound2, but would be willing to network with other systems if a room is of limited interest to what ever systems may be in between.




[#] Sun Sep 02 2007 12:37:37 EDT from IGnatius T Foobar @ Uncensored

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Hateway is mostly gone now anyway. It really didn't add anything to the mix, and it didn't really show the best of what Citadel BBSing can be.

[#] Sat Sep 15 2007 18:53:37 EDT from curly surmudgeon @ Dog Pound BBS II

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Perhaps not but Gateway did a most excellent job of showcasing your sick mind.

[#] Mon Sep 17 2007 14:06:15 EDT from athos-mn @ Haven BBS

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(rolls eyes)

[#] Thu Sep 20 2007 07:12:43 EDT from Freakdog @ Dog Pound BBS II

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Just a note...Dog Pound II will be down for most of today. Electrician is coming, today, to run a subpanel and to rerun the wiring through the new floor joist over the garage, and will knock down the power to most of the house in order to do so.

[#] Thu Sep 20 2007 09:55:44 EDT from MikeP @ Victory Days

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WIMPS, shutting off the power..  Real MEN run power lines HOT. ;)
Thu Sep 20 07:12:43 2007 from Freakdog@dogpound2 (Dog Pound BBS II)

Just a note...Dog Pound II will be down for most of today. Electrician is coming, today, to run a subpanel and to rerun the wiring through the new floor joist over the garage, and will knock down the power to most of the house in order to do so.

[#] Thu Sep 20 2007 12:52:43 EDT from Freakdog @ Dog Pound BBS II

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Yeah, well...

[#] Thu Sep 20 2007 12:55:25 EDT from Freakdog @ Dog Pound BBS II

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Power's back on, BTW...we'll lose our phone/data for a while, a little later, while they rerun those lines through the support structure...we should be back to full, normal operation by mid-to-late afternoon.

[#] Thu Sep 20 2007 13:51:35 EDT from IGnatius T Foobar @ Uncensored

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Yum. I'd like to have a sub panel. The morons who upgraded the power in my house (dunno when it was done, but the house was built in the 1920's so it's obviously not the original wiring) put in a 16 breaker panel. And it's full.

[#] Thu Sep 20 2007 14:17:22 EDT from MikeP @ Victory Days

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When I moved into my newwly build house, I went ahead and dropped a dedicated 80 amp box for my server room.  Wired dedicated ground  20 and 30 amp outlets, and installed a nifty full panel surge supressor/line filter. :)  Put me back a few dollars, but less expensive then having the builders electrician do it.  Eventually I'll get proper PDU's.. but for the meantime I just have the servers pluged directly into the UPS units.

[#] Thu Sep 20 2007 15:35:59 EDT from IGnatius T Foobar @ Uncensored

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A year ago that would have sounded appealing to me. But in the not too distant past the novelty of having a mini data center in my house finally expired.
Now I've got my Internet presence running at a real data center, and am in the process of consolidating my home server facilities to what will eventually be a half-rack in the corner of the basement.

A sprawling computer room at home just isn't worth the space anymore. Maybe if I had a 3,000 square foot home it would still be worthwhile, but with 1,260 square feet and a partial basement, I've got better things to do with the space now.

[#] Thu Sep 20 2007 16:16:09 EDT from MikeP @ Victory Days

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One of the reasons we baught the house that we did was due to the nearly full basement.  Large enough for a good sized office, a theater, and still room left over for a small data center (two racks w/ space to move around easily)  Not quite 3000 sq, but big enough.   Realestate in Indiana is a LOT cheaper then NY.  We paid 1/3rd for this place of what my landlord in Pleasentville wanted to sell his place for, and I have the entire house, not just 2/3rds of it. :)  It is a shame that so many houses out here are on slabs.   Basements are the way to go.

[#] Fri Sep 21 2007 08:30:37 EDT from Ian M. Shot @ Haven BBS

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When we had our house built I asked that my office have its own dedicated circut just to make my life easy.  Well they did that, but only to one outlet.  The rest of the outlets are shared with the other bedroom, and hallway.   Then again the electricians that wired the house screwed up a number of other things much worse than just my office.  The final walk though have a bunch of different electrical things that had to be fixed.   So my office slipped though the cracks. 

[#] Fri Sep 21 2007 10:40:59 EDT from IGnatius T Foobar @ Uncensored

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It seems odd that any house built today wouldn't have each room on its own circuit, considering the central role that technology now plays in our culture and lifestyle.

[#] Fri Sep 21 2007 12:39:21 EDT from Peter Pulse @ Uncensored

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Sep 21 2007 8:30am from Ian M. Shot @haven (Haven BBS)
When we had our house built I asked that my office have its own
dedicated circut just to make my life easy. Well they did that, but
only to one outlet. The rest of the outlets are shared with the
other bedroom, and hallway. Then again the electricians that wired
the house screwed up a number of other things much worse than just my
office. The final walk though have a bunch of different electrical
things that had to be fixed. So my office slipped though the

I guess it depends on your intentions.. but I would be very happy with that setup. Because then you've got two circuits to work with in your office.. one totally dedicated to computer equipment (plug your UPS into it) and the other for whatever lights and appliances you have in the room.

[#] Fri Sep 21 2007 16:07:10 EDT from Ian M. Shot @ Haven BBS

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Fri Sep 21 12:39:21 2007 from Peter Pulse@uncnsrd (Uncensored)

I guess it depends on your intentions.. but I would be very happy with that setup. Because then you've got two circuits to work with in your office.. one totally dedicated to computer equipment (plug your UPS into it) and the other for whatever lights and appliances you have in the room.

I can see that, except I have mutilple machines in there.  A server for testing things out with, my desktop, my laptop and usually some form of firewall.   I have had up to 3 servers, 3 desktops, and 2 laptops at times.  Those times are unusual as it is usually when I am setting up a network or upgrades for other people.  When I am doing consulting work I can have any configuration of machines up to around 8 not including the usual 3 that I use.   So more power would be nice.  Not necessary, but nice. 

[#] Fri Sep 21 2007 16:17:15 EDT from Peter Pulse @ Uncensored

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Ok I still don't get ya. What you asked for was 20 amps coming into the room not shared with any other room. What you got instead was 20 amps coming into the room not shared, plus 20 amps shared with a bedroom and a hallway. You have MORE power than you asked for. Maybe it's a little inconvenient that you have to run some power strips or extension cords to bring that dedicated circuit to other parts of the room.. but you have plenty of power.

[#] Fri Sep 21 2007 17:09:56 EDT from MikeP @ Victory Days

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Another question.. Did they actually erminate the connection w/ a 20 amp outlet?  or a 15??? If it's a 15, then you can't take full advantage of the extra amperage w/o replaceing it.

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