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[#] Mon Oct 16 2006 17:48:10 EDT from curly surmudgeon @ Dog Pound BBS II

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Again, the only reason these anti-smoking laws are being passed is the arrogance and antisocial behavior of smokers. If smokers as a lot were a bit more considerate none of this bullsiht would be happening. I hate it when common decency is violated forcing people to enact laws where none should be required.

Put the assualt and battery laws on hold, let me use a squirt gun or the fire extinguisher on the smoker at the next table. Or water hose...

[#] Mon Oct 16 2006 17:47:05 EDT from wizard of aahz @ Uncensored

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Do you mean hair and skin smoking, clothing smoking or actually having a lit item in ones mouth?

[#] Mon Oct 16 2006 17:48:57 EDT from Grey Elf @ Uncensored

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All depends on my mood. :>

[#] Mon Oct 16 2006 17:55:39 EDT from Curly Surmudgeon @ Haven BBS

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nadia: From your references to teh Channel Islands and In-n-out are you in SoCal? Make sure to try Canters on Fairfax in West Hollywood (try the Canters Special) and the Tommy Burger at Macarthur Park or at the 405 and Roscoe in Van Nuys. Don't bother with the myriad of franchises, hit one of those two.

[#] Mon Oct 16 2006 19:51:36 EDT from nadia @ Uncensored

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curly: thanks for the suggestions. i'm not a fan of burgers, but i think i'll check out canter's deli on friday (when i plan to find myself in la for the last time in the near future)

now if you could find me a real sandwich in santa barbara... well, that's part of the reason i'm looking forward to leaving.

[#] Mon Oct 16 2006 20:42:40 EDT from curly surmudgeon @ Dog Pound BBS II

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Canters is on Fairfax between Melrose and Santa Monica (I think) near the CBS studios. Open 24/7, go anytime. Best Jewish Deli west of New York.

Tommy Burger isn't a hamburger, it's special. Be sure to ask for extra chili on the "burger" and maybe even chili/cheese fries.

As to Santa Barbara, I detest the place. Wonderful location with authoritarians destroying the quality of life. Drive down to Ventura/Oxnard for good Mexican.

[#] Mon Oct 16 2006 20:23:03 EDT from Grey Elf @ Uncensored

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Negro please. These laws are enacted by the same kind of fucking idiots that
stop me on NYC street corners and DEMAND that I put out my cigarette. The
same assholes who feel the need to go to work in a bar, and then complain
about the smoke.

Fuckwits like yourself, and your fucking holier then thou attitudes. When we
had 8+ kids here, we refrain from smoking indoors. When we have pregnant
women over we refrain from smoking indoors, in our own house, so pound
sand up yer ass with those "arrogance and antisocial behavior" remarks.

Second-hand smoke, while not healthy, isn't NEARLY as bad as all the
busybodies make it out to be, considering the two studies they keep
expounding to the press, one was vacated by a court of law for being
patently false, and the other was a loaded report (Inner city black
kids, with bronchial issues, living in ghetto's with smoking parents).

hate when governments legislate religion based bullshit laws, well
it's the same goddamn thing. All these laws are taste-based. You (the
general you) doesn't like cigarette smoke, so NO ONE should be allowed
to smoke. Well, I hate mouth-breathers, so stop fucking breathing.

Oct 16 2006 5:48pm from curly surmudgeon @dogpound2 (Dog Pound BBS II)

Again, the only reason these anti-smoking laws are being passed is the
arrogance and antisocial behavior of smokers. If smokers as a lot were
a bit more considerate none of this bullsiht would be happening. I
hate it when common decency is violated forcing people to enact laws
where none should be required.

Put the assualt and battery laws on hold, let me use a squirt gun or
the fire extinguisher on the smoker at the next table. Or water

[#] Mon Oct 16 2006 21:17:03 EDT from curly surmudgeon @ Dog Pound BBS II

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Hit a nerve, eh?

Health comes before your addiction. Too bad the "fuckwits," as you call them, have to spend precious public resources, time and police action to countermand the arrogance (whoa, Grey Elf!) of polluters.

Your rant is also wrong, second-hand smoke is _more_ harmful than that which comes through filter. We're not talking about _your_ house, yhou are not the center of the universe. Another example of arrogance.

It's the anti-social behavior of folks who force others to breathe their toxins who created this situation. Go after your brethern, not those who chose health.

[#] Mon Oct 16 2006 21:04:25 EDT from Grey Elf @ Uncensored

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Wonderful location with authoritarians destroying the quality of life.

Welcome to my world.

[#] Mon Oct 16 2006 22:15:42 EDT from Grey Elf @ Uncensored

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As usual dicknose, you ignored the meat of the argument because it doesn't
follow your narrow world-view. Show me a credible study, that a) isn't so
slanted as to be worthless, or b) pre-supposed all it's conclusions with
so little data, that it's vacated by a court, that shows second-hand smoke
is as dangerous as all the scare-mongers say it is.

You can't. Don't like smoke, then don't go where there is smoke, don't
legislate your preference for the rest of us. Speak about arrogance. If
I wish to go somewhere that doesn't allow smoking, then I don't smoke. But
that simple personal responsiblity was too much for you fucking idiots.

"I don't like this, so you can't do it." If that isn't the most arrogant
fucking view on the planet, I don't know what is.

Smoking is bad for you. Any schmuck that ever picked up a cigarette and
thought otherwise, deserves brain-cancer of the ass.
Second-hand smoke
isn't good for you either, but not even close to what the PR firms and
the anti-smoking goons say it is. Again, you support people legislating
taste, which makes you a hypocrite.

It's ok to outlaw smoking. (Opinon)
It's ok to legislate religious views. (Opinon)

You agree with one, and disagree with the other, when they're both the
same thing at it's heart. Ergo, you are the hypocrite we all know you
to be.

(And yes, it is a raw nerve with me. Even when I didn't smoke I thought
it was complete bullshit what they do to smokers. We pay more taxes then
anyone else per dollar spent for an item. I disagree with heavy drinking,
does that mean prohibition should return? No, it's just my opinon, thats
the difference between me, and the mongers who think it's their right
to legislate taste. Just like you Curly.)

[#] Tue Oct 17 2006 07:43:26 EDT from fleeb @ Uncensored

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I've noticed that the most virilent non-smokers are those who used to smoke.

[#] Tue Oct 17 2006 09:21:02 EDT from triLcat @ Uncensored

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I'm pretty nasty about it, because I tend to get sick whenever I'm exposed to smoke. For some reason, 10 minutes in a smoky room is almost a guarantee of a really nasty cold.

[#] Tue Oct 17 2006 09:25:36 EDT from Groo the Wanderer @ Uncensored

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I guess the reason people hate second hand smoke so damn much is because it is the one thing that if you are not a smoker you can't do anything about.

If someone is singing badly you can close your ears, if someone smells badly you can put a close pin on your nose.  If someone is a jerk you can ignore them.

When it comes to smoking you can't just stop breathing.  Not only that but it always seemed to me that smokers don't really care about stepping on other

peoples feet.  They throw their butts on the ground making a mess on every street corner on the globe, so you are forced to see that every day every second

everywhere you go.  They breath it in your face, even if unintentional.  They take breaks from work which slow down progress at the work place. 

I could continue but I think you see where I'm going with this.  I just don't understand why smokers have to smoke around people who don't like it.  I can't think of

any other habbit that a person would do that they know annoys people, where they must do it in front of them all the time.


There is no reason a person needs to smoke in a restaurant, or a dinner.  Although I have no idea why a bar isn't legal.  It's not really a health spa in the first place.


[#] Tue Oct 17 2006 09:31:09 EDT from fleeb @ Uncensored

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I think, for a lot of people, smoking after a meal is kind of One Of Those Things that you do.

Sort of like how some people smoke after sex.

[#] Tue Oct 17 2006 09:40:51 EDT from Groo the Wanderer @ Uncensored

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Oh yeah as a non-smoker I hafta usually leave the room.  I get up and shower when a girlfriend of mine does that.  It's so disgusting.

"Wow, dear thanks for ruining a great time.  I'm going to shower." is usualy what I am thinking.  What I say is something totaly different ofcourse.

As a non-smoker having someone smoke after sex has the exact opposite effect on me.  Now if they smoke pot on the other hand, atleast that's something

that smells decent to me and the high is quite euphoric.  Why pot is illegal ill never understand, and it's a ton less harmful than cigs too.

[#] Tue Oct 17 2006 09:42:22 EDT from wabewalker @ Uncensored

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Smoking is very much a part of Japanese culture, just as it used to be here in the US.    In Japan, they post PSA's reminding smokers to be considerate of others.  They even use portable ashtrays over there.  Here the answer is to villify smokers.  I think we find it easier, and maybe more gratifying, to preach and point and criticize instead of just trying to find ways to get along with our differences.  I wonder how a different approach would work here.

I can remember when I was a kid, it was very common to find trash on the ground.  Littering is a horrible, dirty behavior, but lots of people did it.  Hours of PSA's and more public garbage bins seems to have made a big difference.  Instead of being nasty or preachy or dictating someone else's choices, maybe gentler reminders to be more polite would be more effective?

[#] Tue Oct 17 2006 09:42:42 EDT from Groo the Wanderer @ Uncensored

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Well I was going to add "also after sex" but I got ahead of my post there.  Yes after eating out I say "thanks for the great time" etc..

[#] Tue Oct 17 2006 09:48:37 EDT from wabewalker @ Uncensored

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Japanese "Smoking Manners" posters:

[#] Tue Oct 17 2006 09:51:41 EDT from Groo the Wanderer @ Uncensored

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I agree with wabe.  The problem is that one side preaches, and the other side just gets angry so they do something in retaliation, and then the non-smokers

get more preachy and yelly, and start making laws and the smokers then feel like their rights are being violated (which in a sense they are) so they get more

angry and so on and so on.  Personaly I'd be fine with people smoking as long as they stopped throwing butts on the ground.  I'd sacrifice smelling smoke in

a restaurant for that any day of the week.


I remember when people use to smoke in the A&P, people would throw their butts on the floor, odd that they found that acceptable, but probably wouldn't

do it in their own home. 

[#] Tue Oct 17 2006 10:02:05 EDT from Peter Pulse @ Uncensored

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Businesses should be free to decide what they allow, and they can post it on the door.. eg Smoking, No Smoking, Smoking Section or whatever... If you don't want to hang out with smokers, don't go into a business that allows smoking.

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