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[#] Tue Oct 17 2006 01:22:06 EDT from harry @ Uncensored

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Nadia - Don't know. My stereo is far from my computer.


[#] Wed Oct 18 2006 14:46:37 EDT from nadia @ Uncensored

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well you'd still have the same problem even if you invested in another device. you just want a line in capture from your sound card. you should just try it (since the source material is probably degraded anyway) and see ifb you think it's ok, if not, get a better sound card.

[#] Thu Oct 19 2006 02:54:46 EDT from harry @ PixelBBS

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That makes sense. I need to figureout how I can have the stereo system in the computer room. Probly one set of speakers in the computer room and another set in the living room. Hmmm.....

[#] Thu Oct 19 2006 03:26:22 EDT from harry @ Uncensored

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Gonna have to take some measurements.


[#] Thu Oct 19 2006 10:13:51 EDT from Peter Pulse @ Uncensored

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Telephone wire is too thin for a long speaker run. It'll work but you'll get loss and especially you will lose bass definition. But if you have a less than great system to begin with then maybe you will be satisfied with it nonetheless.

[#] Thu Oct 19 2006 10:30:23 EDT from IGnatius T Foobar @ Uncensored

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Telephone wire is definitely too thin. Try to go with something thicker if you can.

If you absolutely must use the telephone wire, though, hopefully it's 4-conductor cable and you can double the conductors up. The results still won't be optimal but it'll "suck less"

[#] Thu Oct 19 2006 12:17:21 EDT from nadia @ Uncensored

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under the assumption that it's temporary, it's not a ig deal. the line out is more important... (since that's the whole point of moving it, right?)

[#] Thu Oct 19 2006 13:04:35 EDT from IGnatius T Foobar @ Uncensored

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It's not an ig deal? :-)

Actually, if it were an IG deal, I would recommend the use of lamp cord as speaker wire. Unless you're running super high power equipment, it makes a quite nice speaker wire.

[#] Thu Oct 19 2006 15:46:47 EDT from nadia @ Uncensored

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see, i knew ig would have a better solution!

[#] Thu Oct 19 2006 17:04:13 EDT from Peter Pulse @ Uncensored

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Most lamp cord is too thin as well, being usually 18 gauge. Sometimes 16 gauge, which is not bad for short runs, but not really good for long runs, if you care about your sound. If I had my amp in the same room with my primary speakers, and wanted to run secondary speakers in another room for casual enjoyment, I wouldn't mind using 16 or even 18 gauge for that although given the choice I would use larger cable. But it is idiotic to spend good money on good equipment then put long runs of 18 gauge wire between it and your primary speakers. Granted, if you look at the wire which is supplied with most stereo equipment or home theatre systems it is all thin, crappy wire.
That is because most audio systems today (or audio portions of home theatre systems) are not particularly great sounding. Starting in the 1950's and all through the 1970's, owning a really good stereo system was a point of pride for any music lover and people spent a great deal of time and money picking out the best system. Starting in the 80's, maybe because of the rise of video or the rise of prerecorded cassettes in the place of vinyl.. probably both.. people started caring less about sound quality, hifi stores went out of business, and appliance stores took over. The rise of integrated circuits and digital media means that it is easier than ever to build a stereo with fairly good sound. But on average, these systems sound worse than the really good stuff of 25 years ago. I don't know why people are willing to pay $3000 for a TV and then put up with 5 channels of awful audio with it, but that is what people seem to enjoy these days.

[#] Thu Oct 19 2006 17:37:11 EDT from IGnatius T Foobar @ Uncensored

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To clarify: the speakers I have connected with lamp cord are satellites. They just don't draw enough current to need bigbig wire. If I were connecting a big pair of towers, then yeah, larger cable would be in order.

[#] Thu Oct 19 2006 19:11:34 EDT from Peter Pulse @ Uncensored

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All your speakers are probably 8 ohms, so they all "draw" the same current at any particular amp output level. But in practice, if anything a small speaker will "draw" more current at a particular volume level than a large speaker, because the small speaker is most likely less efficient, forcing you to turn the amp up to get the same sound level. But the primary reason for using thicker wire is that in order to get a tight bass sound, you want the woofer driven by a very low impedance source. A long run of high resistance wire soon becomes a significant percentage of the load impedance. The cone of the speaker is more free to overshoot and resonate. This is especially true of modern foam edged speakers. In the old days of tube amps, the amps didn't have such low output impedance as now, but the speakers were accoustically loaded with horns.. less cone excursion and stiffer overall construction of the cone edge so it didn't matter as much.

[#] Thu Oct 19 2006 19:58:01 EDT from nadia @ Uncensored

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most things in life come down to impedance matching :)

but again, i'm under the impression that the only reason why he's moving the stereo is to connect the line out to his sound card to rip tapes.

the replacement of the amplifier by the multitentacled av receiver is bad enough, but with these kids only listening to mp3s it's hard to find a reasonable sounding discman (new).

the world is *obviously* ending

[#] Thu Oct 19 2006 20:32:52 EDT from Peter Pulse @ Uncensored

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Haha Nadia I'm gonna steal that line from you :) But yea it's all academic, since his stereo, if it has a built in cassette player, is probably thoroughly mediocre, or worse. If the cassette player is separare, then it makes more sense to just carry the player into the computer room, dub the tape, then put it back when you're done.

Not that I can really talk about mediocre sound. I happen to own a fairly good stereo system, but I haven't used it in a couple of years, since I moved from one apartment to another. One of my speakers needs to be reconed, and I never got around to it. So instead of setting that up, I'm using my dj sound system as my stereo system. It's 3500 watts as currently configured (I have some more speakers that aren't connected right now, that bring it up to 4500).. but I can't run it that loud. Even when I have parties I probably don't go to more than 10% capacity. However, in terms of sound quality, it is not bad but not great either. Low-end Electro-Voice horn tweeters don't hold a candle to my nice ProAc studio monitors (the ones that are sitting in boxes waiting to be reconed)...
But it's ok. It's great to turn it up a bit for DJing...

[#] Thu Oct 19 2006 23:40:46 EDT from harry @ Haven BBS

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The speaker cables using telephone wire are definitely temporary. And so are the speakers. The A set are left over from COLLEGE like about 25 years ago. And the B set are from Radio Shack. So as you can see, this is NOT a high quality lashup at the moment. It is more rather a "proof of concept" setup.

So if I can get any of it to work while expending $0.00 in the process, so much the better. Then if it DOES work, then we'll be looking at investing $$ into better speakers, better speaker wires, and so forth.

I just wanted to see if I could get it to work quickly and so far I have some minor success.


[#] Fri Oct 20 2006 01:40:41 EDT from nadia @ Uncensored

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boxes waiting to be reconed)... But it's ok. It's great to turn it up

a bit for DJing...

your neighbors must be pretty cool :)

but seriously though, the really recent modern stuff isn't even mediocre. non-"audiophiles" (without quotes would i mean sound-haters?) shouldn't need t buy headphone amplifiers; it's just wrong.

[#] Fri Oct 20 2006 09:54:08 EDT from Peter Pulse @ Uncensored

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I live in a loft building in Brooklyn, it is more or less understood that everyone is going to want to make noise sometimes and you have to put up with other poeples noise if you want to make your own. Weeknights after 10-11 are fairly quiet, that is rarely violated. During the day and evening there are bands practicing etc. Stuff louder than me even. Weekends are pretty much do whatever you want, there is usually a party somewhere in the building sometimes several.. bands or djs playing until 4AM is common. When I have parties we generally go all night which does sometimes bring requests to turn it down towards morning. Right now I don't know all my neighbors that well (there's a lot of turnover). I know the guy to my right, he's totally cool.
Not a big noisemaker except when they watch movies. To my left used to be a cool sculptor who was very quiet all the time, but again cool, the bedrooms are furthest away from my apt which helps the noise situation.
But recently he moved out and now there are two unfriendly girls with little dogs that whine and howl at high volume every day. When it gets out of control I play loud, mean dog barks at high volume on my sound system :) Across the hall are a bunch of people sharing the loft, they have parties pretty regularly so they can hardly complain (their guests usually get drunk and trash the hallway, guaranteeing that the super will never get pissed about MY parties, since we are clean). Upstairs used to be a singer on one side and a band on the other. Now there is a DJ on one side (sometimes music I like, sometimes not), and a bunch of students on the other. Right above my bedroom (which is a raised platform, right near the ceiling) there is a couple that has noisy sex.. luckily they are quick about it.

Anyway yea so basically I can't do -anything- I want but I can turn it up loud enough to feel it and then some.. during the day and weekend nights. Weekday nights I can play it loud but not shakingly loud.

[#] Fri Oct 20 2006 09:59:21 EDT from Peter Pulse @ Uncensored

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PS: Re the headphone amps, I think it is a common problem that headphone output amps in mp3 players have undersized coupling caps.. so you get rolled off bass response.. also they are just plain underpowered because of the low voltage available.. you are screwed if you have low impedance headphones because of the bass rolloff and you are screwed if you have high impedance headphones because of the voltage. But yea it is rather silly paying hundreds for a tube headphone amplifier to plug into your ipod... I guess it does make a difference though. It would make more sense if the source material itself was better quality. The whole thing is rather fetish-ey.

[#] Sat Oct 21 2006 16:27:14 EDT from nadia @ Uncensored

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well yeah, that's why i meant for a cd player, not an ipod. my mp3 players sound good for mp3 players, but that doesn't mean much. i've actually never heard the output of an ipod <smug grin>.

so i guess you do for the most part have cool neighbors. i know the perfect thing for you to play for the dogs (at least if they've got some scent-hound in them):
http://www.beaglesunlimited.net/Barking.wav
(it's a beagle hunting a rabbit)

[#] Sat Oct 21 2006 16:32:09 EDT from nadia @ Uncensored

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the cd players a much lower voltage than they used to be. i didn't think aout that. (and my nomad sucks batteries like nobody's business. you just couldn't sell a product like that today. when i stoppped using it for processing i needed 3 sets of (4) nimh batteries to get through a day of processing.)

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